Jabin Botsford/The Washington Post via Getty Images One year ago, Pennsylvania Sen. John Fetterman was getting sworn into office, battling the depression that he would soon enter treatment for, and being castigated by conservatives as a left-wing radical. Heâs entering the presidential election year in a very different place: Condemned by left-leaning Democrats, including some who worked to elect him, for supporting Israelâs war in Gaza without conditions and drawing strange new respect from conservatives for his stances on Israel, immigration, and corruption. Fetterman talked with Americana last week about whatâs going to happen in his swing state this year, and whether heâs really changed since 2016, when he caught progressivesâ attention as an active, unexpected supporter of Bernie Sanders. Americana: How do you see 2024 playing out in Pennsylvania? John Fetterman: Itâs going to be competitive, assuming that Trump is the nominee. Back in 2016, I was one of the rare Democrats that was warning, hey, weâre in trouble. Now, with Dave McCormick â the guy from Connecticut â I believe Bob Caseyâs going to be in good shape. Maybe McCormick has billionaire friends that are going to dump money into his super PAC to carpet-bomb Casey, but that wonât work. Heâs Mr. Pennsylvania. Heâs not the kind of Democrat that makes Republicans angry, and McCormick isnât the kind of guy who makes people say: Boy, I canât wait to get a sign of his in my yard! Americana: Letâs turn to Israel. What was your reaction to the open letter from former campaign staffers urging you to support a ceasefire? âYou canât be a champion of forgotten communities if you cheerlead this war.â John Fetterman: Letâs just put that in perspective. Thatâs a small number of staff compared to the size of the campaign. And I really donât put any value on an opinion that people wonât attach their names to. It doesnât mean anything. Americana: Whatâs the root of your own support for Israel? In 2022, you told Jewish Insider youâd âlean inâ and support it, and you always had. John Fetterman: Itâs the same for anyone who is aware of the history there. What happened on Oct. 7 â that was a true black swan kind of situation. Torturing, raping, mutilating women and girls, and recording all of this. Where does that come from? Itâs not about proportionality. They shot their best shot that day, and they would have killed more if they had the ability to do that. I donât imagine how you could expect anybody to negotiate with an organization that has done that. If you believe in peace, and in a two-state solution, you have to destroy Hamas, and you have to support Israel. Americana: You also said at the time you were passionately opposed to BDS (Boycott, Divestment, Sanctions) â this is before Oct. 7. Why? John Fetterman: Because Israel is really a beacon of the kind of values, the American values and progressive ideals, that you want to see. In that region, itâs our strongest ally, and we have a very special kind of relationship. I donât understand how anybody could vote against the Iron Dome, or want to harm Israeli businesses or the nation or anything. Iâll never understand that. Calling them âcolonizersâ â like, where does this come from? It must be TikTok or some kind of obscure classroom talk. As an alum of Harvard â look, I graduated 25 years ago, and of course it was always a little pinko. But now, I donât recognize it. Americana: A lot of the questions about your views here start with supporting Sanders in 2016, and saying your Senate bid was a âprogressive movement.â John Fetterman: Back in 2015 and 2016, there were things Bernie was working on that were considered kind of extreme. Like we should have a $15 an hour minimum wage, health care is a basic, fundamental human right, marijuana should be legal. But that whole label has just been hijacked to such a weird, extreme place. The thing is, though â I was surprised that when I said I wasnât a progressive, that it made news. Iâve been saying that for years. Even before the [2022] primary, I did an interview where I said that. Those earlier progressive kinds of beliefs have now become political boilerplate. What really is a progressive now? With respect to Israel, thatâs just not something that I identify as anymore. Americana: Youâd also said you might be the âlast man standing here on supporting Israel without conditions.â Do you expect more Democrats to turn against the war and call for a ceasefire? John Fetterman: More and more of my colleagues are calling for it. Itâs so strange. Why arenât you calling for Hamas to surrender? If Hamas surrendered, and turned over their guns, all the killing and all the misery would. Americana: So, not tightening conditions to change policy, or to put pressure on Netanyahu. John Fetterman: I could never support any leader of Israel that doesnât support a two-state solution, of course. But in the middle of this war right now, I donât have conditions on the aid, and I donât expect that is going to change. Americana: You said that itâs not âxenophobicâ to want a secure border. How does your own familyâs experience with immigration â with Gisele coming to America as a migrant, only later getting citizenship â shape your thinking here? John Fetterman: I have a bright red line. My wife was a dreamer. Of course I would never vote to allow them to be put into harmâs way. Canât we have a secure border, and deal with dreamers, and make them all legitimate and stop punishing immigrants that were brought here as children? On enforcement, Iâm not saying letâs start rounding everybody up and do a gigantic, massive deportation. Iâm saying, can we have a comprehensive solution for a secure border, and can we also finally address immigration? Itâs just hard to have a conversation or negotiation if you start throwing around the term âxenophobic.â Americana: You told Politico that you took Twitter off your phone. When? John Fetterman: I kind of did a postmortem in November. I knew it was never going to be a productive pursuit, and certainly not going to support my mental health, wading through that sewer. Iâm still behind all my tweets, but I donât actually have the ability on my phone to create them. I donât want or need that in my life. I can send you the screenshot, if youâd like, where someone told me âIâm rooting for the next blood clot.â It was like: Hey, the far right and far left are able to come together on Twitter! Theyâre both wishing that I die! What have I ever said or done where somebody would want a father of three young children to die? |